SharpCap Forums

I was going to use CPWI to manually align, while testing it this morning I found that once I set up the CPWI to do an alignment, and then switched to SharpCap, my camera’s were no longer listed as, ZWO294, etc., they were listed as ASCOM cameras. A Sharpcap note popped up saying ASCOM cameras would lose some functionality. I tried to rescan the cameras in order to try to restore the original (ZWO settings), closed out CPWI, but the Sharpcap cameras still were showing ASCOM cameras. Only after rebooting my laptop was I able to restore my original camera settings (zwo294, zwo 120).

I’m wondering if CPWI is not a good idea when using SharpCap?

Joe

Hi Joe,

sounds like the camera lost USB connection with the computer.

You normally pick your camera from the 'ZWO cameras' section of the cameras menu - the items there only show up when the appropriate camera is plugged in. SharpCap monitors for notifications about USB devices being added/removed and updates the menu to match.

The ASCOM cameras section of the menu is slightly different - the items listed there show up all the time (even if the camera is not plugged in). If it's not plugged in then you will get an error when you try to open one of those entries.

The fact that the camera vanished from the ZWO section makes it seem likely that the USB connection had dropped, Windows sends out a notification to SharpCap that a USB device has been removed, SharpCap re-checks what ZWO cameras are plugged in and the ZWO software says 'none!', so the menu items vanish. If you look in the SharpCap log, you will see lines like
(Although obviously it will likely be a ZWO camera removed, not an SVBony one!).

Of course, what caused the USB disconnection is the real question... That shouldn't be caused by using CPWI software, but it could happen if the mount movement dislodged a USB cable slightly. A brief glitch in USB power could crash the camera, which would not recover until the reboot cut the power for longer to allow it to reboot?

cheers,

Robin

Appreciate your prompt reply Robin. I shall continue to experiment with CPWI.

It's a great comfort knowing you're at the SharpCap Forum helm.

Joe

Robin's suggestion about investigating a USB drop out is wise. But do ensure all of your settings are correct and ASCOM up to date. You might be using native ZWO drivers, but you still need ASCOM installed. But more about USB....

CPWI and Sharpcap works great with my ZWO ASI294 and Atik Horizon. However, you need solid USB connections. I had loads of problems with too long USB cable, 'Active' cables and powered hubs. The specification for USB3 is incredibly short and voltage drops fast along cable length. 3M is about the limit.

To resolve this, find a wireless or cat 6+ solution. What I do is put an Intel NUC at the scope running Windows 10 Pro, Sharpcap and CPWI (also my focuser software). That is wirelesslessly networked to another PC indoors. I remotely control that at the scope from that indoors using Remote Desktop. This means all my cables are short and my connections reliable. You can similarly do this with Ethernet cable. But USB3 beyond 3 metres is at best flaky. USB2 limit is about 5M before voltages drop fast .

Thanks Noah, I'll be looking into some of the options you mentioned. I know many have turned to ASIair...for now I'll be sticking with my active cable until I decide.

Joe

If I may....I'd like to comment on this issue.

I use Celestron AVX mount, CPWI software (ascom platform) and SharpCap. Nothing else.
As for USB Drop Outs I'd like to offer this: When using a Windows Computer: All USB HUBS have a power save option that should be disabled or your USB port will be put to sleep if Windows doen't think it's being used.

Do this In Windows Computer Manager, Device Manager, you can expand the Universal Serial Bus Controllers (USB) section and select, then right mouse click on each USB Root Hub (or Generic USB Hub) item and select PROPERTIES. This will open a window with 4-5 TABS. If there is a POWER MANAGEMENT Tab, select it and you will see 2 check boxes {} Allow the computer to tun off this device to save power. There is also a check box {} Allow this device to wake the computer. Clear the check box and click OK

Do this for every USB HUB. I support dental offices and this option drove me crazy becasue USB X-Ray sensors (which are camera's of a sort) were going into power save mode and became unresponsive until the PC was rebooted.

If using a Celestron Mount with a Hand Controller connected to your PC then you also want to check the SERIAL port settings for the same power save option. Note that you won't see the PROLIFIC Serial Port listed unless the hand controller is plugged into your PC.

As for my ISSUE; Everytime I unplug any ZWO Camera from my PC's USB port the CPWI Software HANGS and I have to start everyting all over again. Polar alignment, Goto object, redo focusing....all the work to start taking images in SharpCap. And if I want to change the camera for a different target, CPWI Hangs the instant I unplug the ASI294MC ZWO Camera.

I'M STUCK ON THIS ISSUE.

Good Luck with your issue.

Michael

Hi Michael,

thanks for the reminder about the power save option for USB devices - it's certainly a good thing to try with this sort of issue.

Thinking about your issue with CPWI hanging, I'm wondering why would it hang at that point - it's not going to care about the ZWO camera, but maybe something that it does care about (mount, focuser, etc) stops responding to it.

As a diagnostic step, I'd try running USBTreeView and watching what happens when you pull the ZWO camera. I have seen cases (not with ZWO cameras, but models of other brands), where plugging or unplugging a camera seems to upset the whole USB system and lots of devices disconnect and then reconnect soon after.

I would also be tempted to try something like

PC => Hub => ZWO camera
PC => Other Hub => mount/focuser/etc

If the unplug of the ZWO is causing some sort of USB chaos, perhaps putting it on its own hub will restrict that chaos to the hub rather than letting it hit all the devices on the system.

cheers,

Robin

Hi,

I also use an AVX mount, connected to CPWI and SharpCap via ASCOM.
I'm not sure if this will be helpful, but will provide some information.

As already mentioned, updating all drivers and addressing USB cable issues are important.
One more, another factor that comes to mind is the "power supply method".
How do you supply power to your mount, PC, and camera?

Based on my experience, many of these issues are often due to insufficient voltage during power supply.
For example, if the power supply source for the PC and mount is the same (such as the same portable power supply), the connection between the mount and PC may become unstable due to insufficient voltage. Since the camera connected to the PC via USB would also be using the same power source, the camera connection may also become unstable. I have failed several times with this.
In the end, I completely separate and isolate the power supply source for the mount. In my case, this resolved the unstable connection.
An unstable mount connection is fatal for astrophotography…
While I can't say for certain that this matches your situation, I think it's worth checking.

Regarding cable work, long cables can cause not only unstable connections but also noise. If you use long USB cables, using active repeater cables that can supply power to the cable itself may help mitigate the impact. (for stable connection & noise exclusion)
Additionally, I attach ferrite cores to both ends of all cables, not just the main camera cable. (for noise exclusion) With this method, now I am able to operate with a 5-meter USB cable without any issues.

I hope this helps...
Takuya,

As Michael states above, the USB suspend can trip you up. It became a device used by manufacturers to upsell the battery life of their laptops.

For those who are nervous about delving into the inner workings of Windows I have some old notes on this.

Go into Device Manager and expand the Universal Serial Bus Controllers list.
Click on the first entry that has the word Hub in it. The tabs Power and Power Management should be visible. Sometimes only Power Management is there.
The Power tab is useful as it shows how much power is available and how much power a device demands. Lack of power is another of those invisible gotchas.
On the Power Management tab, make sure Allow the computer to turn of this device is unchecked.
Then work down the list for all items that have the word Hub in them.

There is another route into this via Control Panel > Power Options. It is possible to disable the USB Suspend in the power plan. However, create a new power plan and (you guessed it) the default for the plan will be for USB Suspend to be enabled.

Controlling USB suspend via the devices in Device Manager is the better way to go (IMHO).

As I recall, there was an instance when a Windows update re-enabled USB Suspend ( I was managing it through a power plan). Hence the move to controlling devices.

[Note: Personally, I only use mains powered hubs with my kit, which makes sure plenty of reliable power is available for the devices - camera, guide cam, mount, filter wheel. Add in a USB controlled focuser and rotator can put quite a load on the USB subsystem.]

Dave